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"How come we don't have an alchemical compound that..."

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We've added about half a dozen alchemical compounds to the game in the past few months. And in leafing through the forums I see several more proposed. Hell, I bet most of us could come up with a dozen or more potential alchemical compounds that could be a flavorful and useful addition to an alchemist's arsenal. And likewise, I'm sure anyone can understand how it would be impossible to add them all to game carte blanche, as a balance issue.

 

So, why not implement a compromise? Introduce these alchemical items, but any alchemist who wishes to create them must first learn the recipe, which must be purchased with in-game coin or given as a quest reward. Essentially, this would separate alchemical compounds into tiers, basic compounds which are learned upon picking up the appropriate skill rank, and advanced compounds which require a recipe.

 

That way you don't overpower the skill, you make alchemy even more of a cash vacuum than it already was, and you give folks a chance to play with player-created alchemical fire and stun poison and buzzer honey and the like. Thoughts?

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That sounds cool for things that are rare and complex recipies. Plus you'd be able to charge an arm and a leg for them.

 

However, things like "alchemical fire" as I've mentioned on the other post seems to be a rather basic thing to make. Alchemy is expensive as hell to progress in, so for what is available at the moment I dont see it as 'unbalanced' yet... but that's just me.

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That's true, it can. I wasn't complaining about anything, I was just saying adding more to it wouldn't break the system. In the end we're all restricted by the same 20 point production rule.

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The short answer is this: Alchemy is different from Magic in that you learn all the stuff at every level, instead of having to pay for each compound. If it becomes an a la carte skill, then it's too much like Magic.

 

Another answer is that we don't want to give Alchemy so much versatility that it preempts Magic.

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The big differences between alchemy and magic right off the bat is:

 

Alchemy consumables don't come back after convergence (lol).

 

So, ...in theory... if you PC'd saturday morning to saturday night you can have 60 magic points worth of spells.

 

Take those spells and put them into consumables and people will less likely use them unless in dire need. Keeping alchemy items low powered but more versatile might add to the whole "jack of all trades" theme of it but will never trump magic, IMO.

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2-step.....end of story...alchemy is pretty damn powerful man.

 

 

That use to be true up untill 3/4 of the PCs got either Poison immunity, Spirit shield or something else to prevent it. what it comes down to is that alchemy is far less used then Magic, Id like to see some new contact poisons (maby some that do slay or pierce, ones that mimic creeping rot, perhaps one that acts kind of like a dispell...) Id like to see Alchemy become not a replacement or an alternitive to magic, but id like to see it put SOME compitition, if not so that Alchemists have more use in game. HoD and 2 step might occasionaly be made, but they are RARELY if ever used(mainly cause I dont get my hands on them...come on send some alchemy vendors my way >.>) The only thing that Alchemists are putting out of use now are... POWER ELIXERS FOR CASTERS... I wana see them be usefull for everyone.

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You've only got one person's view. From my point of view, I'm using up a whole ton of Alchemical compounds every event. Poisons, Transmutations, Elixir of Cosmic Power, poisons, Grounding Wire...

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We're way ahead of you on this. A few non-standard alchemy items have already gone into game, and the means for PCs to replicate them shouldn't be too far away. Also, I do believe there's a PC savant that could replicate them with a sample...

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I'd also point out that there's no power limit for alchemy.

 

If you want to toss a two-step every 20 seconds of your entire PC shift, you could.

 

It'd be silly expensive, but you could.

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Lol, that sounds like fun... but not as fun as SELLING two-step every 20 seconds.

 

*Rolls in piles of money* yyeesssss...

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How come whenever we talk about alchemy its always Two-Step, Two-Step, Two-Step? Why not those other awesome compounds like Transmutation, Catholicon, or Ogre Extract? Balm of Vigor man! That stuff is so sweet. I admit the the Elixer of Cosmic Power is a little lame, but it needs some loving too.

 

Two-Step is baddass, but those other compound need some lovin' too, right?

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Don't forget acid! Removing shields is hella useful.

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I admit the the Elixer of Cosmic Power is a little lame, but it needs some loving too.

What are you talking about? The Zhuhao drank one of those every Saturday morning for the first year he was in Pinedale...

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What are you talking about? The Zhuhao drank one of those every Saturday morning for the first year he was in Pinedale...

 

 

AND HIS NOSE FELL OFF! Seriously, people, remember your noses.

 

;)

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Yeah dude, he went from little droopy to pointy and ugly. He got meaner too. Maybe we should put a warning label on that stuff.

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We fed one to Veria last game, and I don't think she got appreciably more pointy or meaner. Can't be the Cosmic Power.

 

*waits for Dave to lose his mind at our inability to stay on topic today, and grins*

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I don't know, body parts falling off from prolonged use of alchemical goods seems pretty on-topic to me.

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How come whenever we talk about alchemy its always Two-Step, Two-Step, Two-Step? Why not those other awesome compounds like Transmutation, Catholicon, or Ogre Extract? Balm of Vigor man! That stuff is so sweet. I admit the the Elixer of Cosmic Power is a little lame, but it needs some loving too.

 

Two-Step is baddass, but those other compound need some lovin' too, right?

 

 

That was part of my point, only specific Alchemichal components are being utilized, or desired... why spend coin for a level 5 alchemical component for a gameday when you can pop a level 1 magic spell(or a potion there of which is MUCH cheeper) for 10 minutes of the same effect, your more likely going to save the cash unless you fight ALOT durring that gameday(which rarely happens, especialy with the possibility of death durring EACH encounter.) someone else can do the math to find out how many battles would make up the coin expendature and then add on to that the fact you WONT make up the monitary difference.

 

Id be happy if some of those things went out as Loot sometimes... I think that might be part of the issue to. I think part of the issue was/is that not everyone has Herbalism, most everyone can cast magic. Alchemical goods can only be used by those with herbalism so its a hit or miss if someone can actualy use them.

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Forgive me man, but your last post is a bunch of nonsense. There are a TON of alchemical items that are usable with no skill. Also, in most cases, Alchemy has been pretty carefully balanced to be just a tad more expensive than the closest magical equivalent, and this was deliberate.

 

You need to look over the rules more carefully and do some math.

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Alchemy grants greater versatility and the ability to store up compounds at the price of a higher monetary cost and a slower rate of production. This was especially true before we halved the price of production points. Which, as the padawan of thread derailers, I'd like to comment has done very good things for our IC economy.

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How come whenever we talk about alchemy its always Two-Step, Two-Step, Two-Step? Why not those other awesome compounds like Transmutation, Catholicon, or Ogre Extract?

 

Because everyone would rather pay less money for ...say... a potion of toughness or strength. And just use them when they're needed. I mean... it's cool and all that you get +2 body or +strength for a day or whatever, but I'd rather pay for a few 10-minute potions for cheap than waste a boatload of money on an expensive level 5 alchemy potion.

 

I think the reason 2-step is awesome is simply the fact that you cant really get a throwable 4 poison slay by other means (that I can think off). (Ethereal sealant will be another popular item, I think)

 

Even during the battle against the undead that night, a scroll of enchant weapon was sufficient enough to get the job done rather than having to use up a transmute oil.

 

I'm not saying alchemy skills are useless or anything, I'm just saying they're a 'last resort'.

 

When I have a choice between crafting something to give me +2 body, or dropping most enemies in one hit, I'll go with the latter. Especially if that enemy hits hard with melee. I'd put 1 point into the toughness spell if I really wanted the extra body. Also, for someone who duel wields for 2, strength bonuses are kind of useless. It'd be nice to have some new contact poisons that do more than just add damage.

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I think the reason 2-step is awesome is simply the fact that you cant really get a throwable 4 poison slay by other means (that I can think off). (Ethereal sealant will be another popular item, I think)

 

Just a nitpick to avoid future confusion, 2-Step is "4 poison pierce".

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