[hivemind]

As many of you know, KoN puts out a new edition of the rulebook every two years. This April, we'll be moving from 3.5 to 4.0. Most of the changes won't actually be changes, they're already codified in the errata that was put out last year or in the clarifications that have been issued this year. There are some changes though, and while I'm not going to run down them all here and now, I do want to let players know about the changes to the armor system that are coming. You have a good bit of time to prepare between now and April.

We used to proudly describe KoN as "a game where three level 1 dudes with spears can kill anyone", but that is clearly not true. Like many games, we've experienced some numbers creep, and we need to dial things back a bit before we become NERO. We also eliminated the "Armor Use" skill a while ago, because it seemed like requiring a skill on top of needing to buy armor and be in shape enough to wear metal armor was penalty enough, but with the advent of Enhance Armor, people are able to turn a light leather vest or bodice in to a chainmail shirt. This is clearly not the direction we ever meant to go in - there needs to be a trade-off to get the protection of armor, whether it's financial, physical, or game mechanics, and right now there's not.

Starting in April 2010 (the boldface sections are changes from the current rules):

13. Armor
13.1. Armor must never impede the normal movement of a player’s body in a fashion that endangers the wearer or prevents the player from following the rules of the game, e.g. If a player is wearing armor that prevents them from kneeling, they are unable to properly accept leg wounds.
13.2. Armor must be attached or fitted on the body with proper integral closures such as buckles, laces, or snaps. Players are not allowed to attach armor to their body with tape, string, or similar temporary means.
13.3. Wearing armor does not count as a costume and players are required to wear a proper costume under their armor at all times.
13.3.1. This includes racial make-up EVEN if the player is wearing a full-face helmet.
13.4. Players wearing plate armor are required to wear a padded gambeson or arming jack underneath the armor.
13.5. Armor that consistently causes unreasonable damage to weapons will be removed from play.
13.6. Metal armor
13.6.1. Metal armor plates are of at least 18 gauge (.0500 inch, slightly thinner than 1/16 of an inch) thickness.
13.6.2. Chain mail rings should be of no greater than 1/2 inch inside diameter.
13.6.3. Chain mail rings may be of no less than 18 gauge (.0403 inch, about 1 millimeter) wire.
13.6.4. All edges of metal plates should be safely blunted or rolled.
13.6.5. Metal scales must overlap to provide armor value.
13.7. Leather armor
13.7.1. Leather armor must be constructed of real leather. No pleather, vinyl, or other synthetic leathers are acceptable.
13.7.2. Studded leathers may be studded with metal spots, rings, washers or rivets. No bottle caps, brads or plastic may be used.
13.7.3. Studded leather should have no more than 1 inch of un-studded leather on any part of it.
13.7.4. Leather scales must overlap to provide armor value.
13.7.5. Light leather is leather of at least 6 ounce weight (3/32 inch, 2.4 mm).
13.7.6. Heavy leather is leather of at least 10 ounce weight (5/32 inch, 4 mm).
13.7.7. Hide is leather of at least 14 ounce weight (7/32 inch, 5.6 mm).
13.7.8. Leather is a natural material with natural variations that may result in irregular measurements. Players are free to request an average of multiple (up to five) measurements when their armor is measured for its armor point value.
13.7.9. No more than two layers of leather are permitted in any area being measured for armor point value.
13.8. Armor made of non-period materials (plastics, kydex, nylon, etc.) is not allowed.
13.8.1. Non-period metals or alloys, such as aluminum, titanium, galvanized steel, stainless steel, nickel-plated steel, or anodized aluminum are allowed.
13.9. Armor counts for between 1 and 4 points of protection.
13.9.1. Only areas that are actually covered by armor gain the protection from it.
13.9.2. Monstrous armor takes only one damage from sources without the Slay ability.
13.9.2.1. The Monstrous ability is only granted to areas covered with 3 point or 4 point armors, not to areas covered by lesser armors being counted as a greater points value to match torso armor.
13.10. Combining or layering armor does not give a player more than one armor point value.
13.10.1. The character still has a single, main armor value that is based on the armor they are wearing on their torso.
13.10.2. To wear other armor, such as legs and arms, and have it count as coverage, that armor must be no more than one point lower than the player’s torso armor value.
13.10.3. Limb armor may be of a higher point value than the torso armor
13.10.3.1. In this case, the limb armor uses the lower armor point value of the torso armor.
13.10.3. Players may count their torso armor as lower than its listed value to get limb armor to count.
13.10.3.1. Rule 13.10 also applies to helmets.
13.11. Helmets grant universal armor.
13.11.1. Universal armor covers all hit locations.
13.11.2. Light helmets grant 1 point of universal armor.
13.11.2.1. Light helmets are helmets that cover at least the entire crown of the head, but have minimal or no neck and face coverage.
13.11.2.2. Light helmets must be constructed of metal.
13.11.3. Heavy helmets grant 1 point of universal armor.
13.11.3.1. Heavy helmets are helmets that cover the face and neck.
13.11.3.2. Heavy helmets must be constructed of at least light leather.
13.12. Armor Point Values
13.12.1. One point armor:
13.12.1.1. Full Costume: A player dressed in a full, appropriate fantasy or historical costume, free of anachronisms, from head to toe, is granted one point of complete armor coverage.
13.12.1.1.1. This allowance may not be combined with a helmet or other armor. Players who wish to claim this point of armor must present themselves in full garb to Logistics to be inspected.
13.12.1.2. Studded leather.
13.12.1.3. Light leather.
13.12.1.4. Furs: Real animal hides with the fur on, unless the leather is thick enough to qualify as a higher value by itself.
13.12.1.5. Helmet only.
13.12.2. Two point armor:
13.12.2.1. Studded light leather.
13.12.2.2. Armor made from overlapping light leather pieces such as scale armor, lamellar or leather brigandine.
13.12.2.3. Heavy leather.
13.12.2.4. Any 1 point armor with a helmet.
13.12.3. Three point armor:
13.12.3.1. Studded heavy leather.
13.12.3.2. Armor made from overlapping heavy leather pieces such as scale armor, lamellar or leather brigandine.
13.12.3.3. Chain armor: Armor made of interlocking butted or riveted metal wire.
13.12.3.4. Metal scale or lamellar armor
13.12.3.5. Hide: Stiff leather 1/4 inch or thicker. Also includes waxed or water hardened heavy leather.
13.12.3.6. Half-plate: metal plate armor that does not incorporate any articulated joints and/or has up to 75% exposed leather or chain.
13.12.3.6.1. Lorica Segmentata is half-plate armor.
13.12.3.6.2. A 2-piece back-and-breast is half-plate armor.
13.12.3.6.2. Half-plate armor counts as Monstrous.
13.12.3.7. Any 2 point armor with a helmet.
13.12.4. Four point armor:
13.12.4.1. The qualification for 4 point armor is rigidity - the ability to withstand blunt force trauma.
13.12.4.2. Four point armor is Monstrous.
13.12.4.3. Studded hide.
13.12.4.4. Armor made from overlapping hide pieces such as scale armor, lamellar or leather brigandine.
13.12.4.5. Articulated plate armor: Plate armor with flexible joints that can bend and move with the movements of the player while still providing complete coverage.
13.12.4.5.1. Articulated armor must be a complete harness, e.g. articulated arms would contain a full vambrace, articulated elbow, rerebrace, and pauldrons.
13.12.4.5.2. Wearing incomplete articulated plate, e.g. wearing a back-and-breast without fauld, tassets and gorget, makes it half plate armor.
13.12.4.6. Any 3-point armor with a helmet.
13.12.5. Five point armor:
13.12.5.1. Any four point armor with a helmet.

==========================================

So, changes in a nutshell:

++ everything but chain counts as a point less

++ unstudded garment leather is no longer armor

++ there are clear guidelines about what goes where, thicknesses, gauges, and materials

++ "studded" now takes twice as much studding

++ helmets are now all 1 point, and leather helmets must cover the face and neck to count as helmets

++ gambesons are required under any plate (we do this now, but it's not in the rulebook)

The other piece of these changes is that the spell Enhance Armor is either going to be removed entirely, or replaced with a severely nerfed version of itself.

If you are a person currently depending on a leather vest, leather skullcap and Enhance Armor for your 4 points of protection, these changes impact you pretty severely. Everyone else, not so much. Some people will need to add more studs to some leather armor pieces. Some of the minute details of this might get tweaked a tiny bit between now and the rulebook printing in February, but I wouldn't count on it.

Questions?

[Rhaveniel]

Thank you for posting this Dave. If nothing else, I know not to have any items ornamented to enhance armor until after the new rules are posted.

[Eppe00863]

Are ornamented items that provide +2 armor still going to be made available, possibly at a higher craft point cost than they currently are?

[Eppe00863]

Also, where would a coat-of-plates style piece of torso armor fall in these rules? Are they just not acceptable anymore?

[hivemind]

We haven't talked about the Ornamenting buffs yet.

Your armor is 2-point armor if it's thick enough. 1-point otherwise.

[Octavius]

Brigadine? Would this be 2 pts?

[hivemind]

13.6.5 means that's leather armor. Looks like 1-point to me.

[Dren Ollevres]

How is studded "light" leather worth 2 points, but light leather with large sections of plate metal all over it is only worth 1? (or does it need 75% coverage of plates?)

Also, how resilient is Hide armor where if you stud it, it becomes equivalent to full plate?

[Eppe00863]

I meant something more like metal brigandine, where the aromor would be more like 2"x3" plates that are riveted between garment leather backing and facings...It's a new set of armor that I was thinking of making to change my look.

But the other info is good to know about as well

We haven't talked about the Ornamenting buffs yet.

Your armor is 2-point armor if it's thick enough. 1-point otherwise.

[hivemind]

How is studded "light" leather worth 2 points, but light leather with large sections of plate metal all over it is only worth 1? (or does it need 75% coverage of plates?)

Also, how resilient is Hide armor where if you stud it, it becomes equivalent to full plate?

If the metal "plates" don't overlap, then it depends entirely on the the thickness of the leather underneath. The leather in that picture looks thin to me. If it qualifes as something thicker after being measured, then it'll count as studded leather of that grade.

Studded hide isn't monstrous.

[Xicris]

Can't we just bump Enhanced Armor back up to 2nd level where it used to be instead of removing it? Or maybe make it only grant 1 extra armor point? Removing this plus the armor changes is going to lose Xicris 3 points of protection, and its kinda something I've relied on to stay alive in combat. Yeah, being selfish but the math is sorta relevant.

I'm not complaining about dialing down the numbers, mind you. I was getting worried that everything was getting overpowered, but I'm a little concerned about taking such a big hit to my HP

[Vany'a]

This isn't an armor question but something I had been wondering about and was curious if the rule may or may not be changing.

In the Rulebook where it talks about fae-kin.
It mentions Humans, Elves, and Terran as being able to be fae touched.
It then says that no Snow Goblin has ever become fae.

I don't think it mentioned Drakes either way, except saying that fae-kin tend to avoid them.
I know back in the days of Dragons it'd be really difficult for such a thing to happen, but I imagine as the drakes became more humanoid, bipedal, it could be possible? And I didn't know if, because fae-kin usually avoided them, that actual fae did, too, or if there was a possibility there. If it -was- possible, I wasn't sure if the drake would need to have colored hair like the red drake mask has, or have brightly colored spikes or something.

I only ask because my alt / future character will be a drake, I'd be playing one now if I had been pleased with my mask, and am re-designing one that I think will work much better for long-term wear. The idea of possibly playing a fae-touched drake just makes me click my heels together happily.

If this is something that I have to wait till April to find out, I will do so. But I figure it never hurts to ask.

[Falco Kadrim]

Can't we just bump Enhanced Armor back up to 2nd level where it used to be instead of removing it? Or maybe make it only grant 1 extra armor point? Removing this plus the armor changes is going to lose Xicris 3 points of protection, and its kinda something I've relied on to stay alive in combat. Yeah, being selfish but the math is sorta relevant.

I'm not complaining about dialing down the numbers, mind you. I was getting worried that everything was getting overpowered, but I'm a little concerned about taking such a big hit to my HP

I actually like the idea of removing it, or nerfing it down. +2 armor is pretty tough. Especially when it makes 3 Pt monstrous (the new segmentata) 5 pt armor + helm = 6 pts of Monstrous armor... That's 6 hits it will have to take, not to mention if you have Abomination with any body. My character could take 10 hits to the chest from a monster before falling at a mear lvl 10.

Without Enhance armor, i'm much easier to take down. Especially with the new version of armor values and such. It makes people more apt to die. Say what you want, but I've heard many heavily armored people say "i'm down to my last few hits". Well, now your down to 0 with these new rules.. I like it.

We haven't even started playing these rules, and the fear of death has returned.. LOL!

[Coroth]

I think the point we are trying to look at is that just about any character, with the simplest of armor and the right buffs can be a front line, tank it all fighter. With the changes that are being made, if you want to fill that role you will need to wear significant armor to do so. If not, you will need to adapt your fighting style, weapons and use your wits to stay alive.

[Jenica]

One of the examples that I threw out in initial discussions was Nasri. With body, light leather armor and helmet, a magic belt, and buffs from her friends, she could (and almost always did) roll out at 11... and then cast Abomination on herself.

Ludicrous.

Nice, but still ludicrous.

So we're going to dial it down.

[Dren Ollevres]

If the metal "plates" don't overlap, then it depends entirely on the the thickness of the leather underneath. The leather in that picture looks thin to me. If it qualifes as something thicker after being measured, then it'll count as studded leather of that grade.

Studded hide isn't monstrous.

13.12.4. Four point armor:
13.12.4.1. The qualification for 4 point armor is rigidity - the ability to withstand blunt force trauma.
13.12.4.2. Four point armor is Monstrous.
13.12.4.3. Studded hide.


As to your point above, Jenica, the amount of power used to buff you up costs quite a bit. I agree that light leather with enhance armor is cheap, but that abomination only lasts 10 minutes. 11 hits before dying should equate to Shadowskin for 10 minutes.

All those buffs on you cost nearly 10 power points! (for only 10 minutes of awesome).

[hivemind]

I spent a shift at the November game doing Combat Referee stuff. I watched several combats. In each combat, I watched a lightly- or un-armored PC get jumped from behind, taken unawares in combat, or otherwise be thoroughly 0wned by multiple NPCs. I'm talking I counted ten damage plus each time. These PCs would simply shrug that off.

After each combat, I went to the PCs and had them run down their protections, point by point, with me (some of you probably remember me doing this, I did it a half-dozen times at least). I couldn't believe there wasn't some rhinohiding going on, or at least some bad math. On the contrary, each time the player listed off 12-15 points of protection, between armor, Body and buffs. These were not tank-type warriors in heavy armor, in most cases they were little weedy people in light leather.

This is not the game we're supposed to be playing. Combat should be scary, life-or-death, every damned time. Armor should actually be armor, as opposed to a vehicle to hang Enhance Armor and Ablative Armor on.

[hivemind]

13.12.4. Four point armor:
13.12.4.1. The qualification for 4 point armor is rigidity - the ability to withstand blunt force trauma.
13.12.4.2. Four point armor is Monstrous.
13.12.4.3. Studded hide.
As to your point above, Jenica, the amount of power used to buff you up costs quite a bit. I agree that light leather with enhance armor is cheap, but that abomination only lasts 10 minutes. 11 hits before dying should equate to Shadowskin for 10 minutes.

All those buffs on you cost nearly 10 power points! (for only 10 minutes of awesome).

I stand corrected on Studded Hide. These are new rules, and still being edited, so even the guy who wrote them doesn't have them forwards and back yet. As I said, they're still subject to change, so if you're trying to break or min-max them based on what I've posted above as a courtesy heads-up, stop it.

Most groups only fight something once or twice a shift, so if you spend ten power to be nigh-invincible for those two fights, it's the same as being invincible all the time. I don't care how much Magic Power is used, we should not have unarmored people being combat gods - unless they're just that good.

[Dren Ollevres]

Then perhaps it's the abomination that causes the issue. 11 points of damage soak is two heavy hits in combat... the third hit dropping you like a ton of bricks. That's not too unreasonable in normal situations.

If abomination only applied to your physical body, maybe that would fix the "combat god" syndrome without making defensive buffs utterly useless to anyone who doesnt cast abomination.

[Octavius]

Then perhaps it's the abomination that causes the issue. 11 points of damage soak is two heavy hits in combat... the third hit dropping you like a ton of bricks. That's not too unreasonable in normal situations.

If abomination only applied to your physical body, maybe that would fix the "combat god" syndrome without making defensive buffs utterly useless to anyone who doesnt cast abomination.

For what my opinion is worth, I agree with the current armor changes. Also I like this idea. Abomination would still be a good spell... and it cuts down the ridiculousness of lots monstrous armor.